Ed2Go is NOT Higher Education
For several years now I have railed against the use of ed2go courses when they are affiliated with a college or university. During my time on the Minnesota Online Council I was especially adamant against the listing of the ed2go courses at the MnOnline website as though they were endorsed courses from a member institution. There is no way that I think the brand should be diluted by including courses like this in our offerings. Why not? Glad you asked.NOTE: most of this post was written after I discovered that my own school had recently signed on with ed2go. This saddens me to no end since I spent the past five years railing against the use of ed2go in Minnesota Online and our colleges. Our VP in that division assures me that they will do what they can to not harm our reputation for quality online offerings - and I believe that, I'm just not sure how much of that we can actually control. I waited a couple of weeks before posting this to see whether my opinion would be changed by other people around here - and now I'm pretty sure that's not going to happen.
ed2go courses are what they are. They aren't what they aren't. They aren't college courses. They aren't OUR courses. They aren't taught by our faculty. They aren't developed and vetted by us. Their web services aren't supported by us. The assessments aren't created and evaluated by us. Student successes (and failures) aren't determined by us. (etc., etc.!!)
So why the heck do we brand these as OUR courses? Why are we saying that we have this online instruction center (below) when it isn't true? We do have an e-Campus at Lake Superior College, where students and faculty can come for help, but it has nothing to do with these ed2go courses. We have worked very hard over the past 11 years to build a stellar reputation for our online offerings at LSC. Now our reputation also depends on a profit-seeking company that has no connection to us whatsoever and over whom we have no control.
And why would Minnesota Online want courses like the one shown below listed on the MnOnline website?
That's an ed2go course, and it's probably not the only one that is being called a MnOnline course.
And now for the best part(s). Don't you just love testimonials? How about when the same testimonial is used for each of the first five schools (all in MnSCU) that I looked at on the ed2go website. Laura really gets around since it appears as though she takes classes from almost all of the schools.
Final point. Notice how the graphic above mentions accreditation? Take a look at this next one, it's even better.
Doesn't this strike you as more than just a little bit odd? It definitely strikes me that way. Schools are touting their accreditation status while promoting courses that they have absolutely nothing to do with (except collecting a little bit of revenue). Their faculty don't teach the courses or develop the curriculum, their employees most often are oblivious that these courses are even being offered, and yet somehow this seems to be the time to hype up the school's accreditation. Seems to me that this type of offering completely flies in the face of accreditation. Isn't it ed2go that needs to be accredited to do this stuff? I'm just asking.Of course I can already hear the excuses for this. "Well, our accreditation doesn't cover continuing education and non-credit offerings, just our degree programs and such." Point #1: then why are schools hyping their accreditation status on a page that deals with continuing education? Point #2: Maybe our accreditation isn't affected, but our reputation is.
I don’t care whether 1,500 other schools are using Ed2Go and telling the world that people are taking courses from “their schools.” That only tells me that administrators at 1,500 schools are making very poor decisions and are willing to stake their reputations on something over which they have no control.
Okay, one more that I just couldn't resist. I have (should I say "had?") lots of friends at North Hennepin CC. But it's just downright embarrassing when their ed2go site says the following: "North Hennepin Community College is accredited by MnSCU." (Ummh, NO, they're not!) In fact, I think this whole scam is a major embarrassment, but apparently I'm the only who's embarrassed by it.
Comments
After having read your position, I will steer clear of the course altogether. Thanks for giving me pause to think. You probably saved me from an bad experience.
1. To "anonymous said" payment online is the preferred method. You locate a school you wish to take the course from (usually by putting in the name of the institution, or a zip code) then you go to the institutions site. Each institution handles receiving the payment, and signing you up for courses. Not only do they have specific phone numbers and people to talk to,at most schools,but the e-mails to those contacts.
I have taken two courses so far and had no difficulty at all.
2. Most of the courses are NOT listed as giving college credit. There are a few that give certificates, and Continuing Education Credit.
A certificate is just that, not a degree. And their continuing education credits ARE approved by a national approval agency, that is accepted by most states.
EACH area such as social work, nursing, and so on has it's own requirements for continuing education credit, and requirements of an approval agency. MY state lists the approving agency provided by Ed2go, as one that IS accepted.
3. The professors qualifications are clearly spelled out for each course. For the most part the professors ARE outstandingly qualified. UNLIKE many community colleges and universities.
4.I have TWO degrees from two different universities, and have attended 5 different colleges or universities. So I am very familiar with the quality of "in school" versus "online" instruction,and so far, both of my online courses with Ed2go have given me more bang for less buck and A GREAT DEAL more interaction with the professors.
5. The sylabus is available online for any student to review what the course will teach and see if it will meet their needs.
6. The testimonials. I have written a few, and one of mine has been used. It was ONLY used for the course I wrote it for, because it was specific to that course. However, if I wrote one that said, "hey this is an easy way to get up to speed on many topics for not much money" then I would expect that this testimonial could be used as a "general" testimonial for Ed2go appropriately.
7. I have looked at the pricing at different schools offering the classes. I have noticed a slight difference, and suppose you are paying for the "prestige" of the school. For instance Loyolla Marymount University in Los Angeles seems to charge more, BUT one tends to think of their prestige as superior to a community college ...though the SAME professors teach the same course. By the way, I have taken the same course, with the same book, at community colleges and universities, and the content is not different, the tests may be, the teachers are (though Ed2go's are superior)...but in the end, it is the ammount of work a student is willing to put in to learning something that determines what they will get out of ANY course.
Finnally, I noted a definite emotional content to the original message "Ed2Go is NOT Higher Education". ((by the way Ed2go does not pretend to be "higher" education, just an alternate method to assist people to learn, with perhaps a sheet of paper (IF you pass the post test, and complete the assignments)to demonstrate to others you have some familiarity with the subject.))So, if my ENTIRE response is NOT posted as a rebuttal, I will NOT be surprised; because an emotional attack does not appreciate an objective one. j
In addition, the computer classes are 2nd to none.
It may not be higher education, but it is an informative, hands on education...nontheless.
The last class I took was earlier this year. The Admin. Asst. class is good if you want to run a small business that will interact with different types of clients (i.e. lawyers, logistics people and other occupations that are realistically boring). Otherwise, with the exception of the accounting module, the rest had little to do with lesson plan. There were these long-winded editorials that I once challenged because I felt it was incorrect and based on nothing. They took offense to that and so far I see they did not return to my local community college. I would not recommend ed2go for major career changes. Just to be fair.
The thing is that I'm a lifelong learner and have taken classes at many accredited schools both in traditional "on-the-ground" classrooms and through online distance learning. The fact is, and some traditional "highbrows" won't approve but Ed2Go is good to go. Yes, I am taking them through local community colleges because they are actually cheaper than the online prices.
I've read a few comments about Ed2Go classes not meeting people's expectations. I can tell you that I have attended many reputable schools accredited by the U.S. Board of Education that genuinely stunk!
I agree that Ed2Go is not higher education. It isn't. It is broader education. I've taken two courses, one; the A to Z in Grantwriting and the other; Research Methods for Writers and I learned quite a bit from them. Both will be valuable to my future and I plan to take still more classes. Why?
They were as good as many of my other online classes and I could find at Ed2Go classes, I can't get at a regular CC. So for those that would let a little challenge like "no Online payment" get in your way, then thanks for leaving a little more room for the rest of us.
I took the course Winning strategy for the courtroom and I believe it is amazing!
Enough information for the money I spent! I do not expect to become a Lawyer in US but now I understand many things seen on TV!
I have written and taught three Ed2Go software courses. I have also taken a number of their software courses. Having tried other online sources for distance learning, I always end up returning to Ed2Go's offerings.
The courses are aimed at general-population adults. They are intended as continuing education courses, not college level courses. And college credit is not offered.
As another respondent pointed out, the instructors are carefully vetted, and must demonstrate expertise and accomplishment in the field.
Admittedly, some of their older offerings are pretty pathetic, but they still seem to enjoy a following. (If a course's enrollment declines to a certain level, Ed2Go drops the course from their catalog.)
In the meantime Ed2Go continues to refine their strict course-structure requirements and writing guidelines for authors. They also maintain strictly enforced standards for online instruction.
It is noteworthy that a few years ago, when the international textbook publisher Thomson Learning (Cengage) was in the market for an online adult-ed publisher to partner with, they chose Ed2Go.
BUT as a UW-Madison faculty member, I got suspicious of the use of the UW-Madison logo on virtually every page, and for every course, offered by ed2go once I had registered for the site. It is quite clear that most of the courses are NOT offered by UW-Madison, yet someone who wasn't paying close attention (like me, at first) might infer otherwise.
I'm inquiring with the people at UW-Madison who should know whether they sponsor any content on the ed2go site, but my impression at the moment is that ed2go is brazenly misrepresenting their associations with brick-and-mortar institutions.
I'm amused by all the apologists who have commented here, because most of them appear to be Ed2Go drones who are here to tell us how great Ed2Go courses are. Guess what? I don't care. This post has nothing to do with whether the courses contain valuable content - it has everything to do with whether or not they are college courses as they are being branded.
That's the point - nothing else.
I understand the branding issue that you are speaking about. I actually found the ed2go classes through my local college catalogue, so they are vetting the programs to some extent, almost as if each prof. is a visiting prof., if you will.
I chose a photoshop class that was not offered in the catalogue (after going to ed2go and seeing what they had to offer) and the college did call me to double check my choice and discuss it with me, so I feel, again, that they are vetting the Ed2Go company.
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continuing education
It looks like they're legit enough for what I need, namely a basic intro to the fundamentals of PHP (which I know a bit about but not in any formalized way). It won't be something I'm putting on a CV, just a skill I want to improve for a comparatively low price. I'm just looking for a training class.
I agree with the main point of your post, though. 1) talking about accreditation so much comes off a bit weird & 2) if they're not part of the school, they shouldn't pretend to be. Dunno if I'll go, I'm looking at other places too.
Anyway, thanks for the post, I'm glad they're associated enough with colleges that they're not actually a scam even if they're also not truly higher ed.
There are plenty of vendors and publishers selling both traditional and online content-for both non-credit and credit programs. To be fair, there are plenty of publishers selling textbooks with online content, that are often the primary content students have available to them in credit undergraduate and graduate courses. If colleges shouldn't use a for-profit business like Ed2Go for online non-credit content, should colleges and universities use publisher traditional or online content not created by their instructors or professors? For fields in computers and health, could the college and university faculty really keep up with the latest changes?
I've taught credit and non-credit traditional and online courses, and have taken Ed2Go courses, and the quality often varies based on the publisher, as well as the instructor. I've taken plenty of bad as well as good non-credit traditional and online courses as well as credit undergraduate and graduate traditional and online classes. If either the instructor or content is poor, the course is often poor. But I have taken graduate online courses that had good online materials, provided by the textbook publisher, that overcame the indifference of the professor. But how often are students aware of what materials were supplied in a traditional or online class by the publisher, or by the instructor?
I'm not an advocate for Ed2Go, I could care less if the courses are offered or not-but if the need is there, someone will fill it. The question is whether colleges will rely on vendors and publishers, or have the resources to pay their faculty what it would take to develop unique materials for their traditional and online classes. Based on the attitude towards government spending, colleges will be forced to rely on vendors and publishers more and more.
I wonder if instructors who get in a twist about this aren't really concerned about losing revenue for themselves.
At any rate, if quality if a concern, the marketplace will take level things out. For the time being, these courses have some credibility with some specific types of students. Take the person who was "on the verge of signing up for an Access 2007 course." How many colleges or universities offer Access courses? Most likely, this person will have to go to a private, for-profit computer software training company and probably pay a lot more than the Ed2Go course would cost.
Yes, some of the courses and some of the instructors are better than others -- but that's no different than when one is taking a traditional classroom course. I remember all too vividly a graduate philosophy course that I paid good bucks for and the instructor, who was tenured, spent most of the class sessions singing songs from Broadway musicals and rambling on about his favorite cartoon characters because he suffered from a mental illness.
It did say that it was backed by my local community college but that was it.
Before I started I looked into the quality of the classes and found most comments on them to be good. So I joined and have been happy so far with the teaching. It's really broken down the information for me, even more than my college visual basic class which had a horribly boring teacher that didn't explain anything.
Programming is not easy to teach and if they have done this food with java for me then they should do fine for others as well. I'll definitely be taking more classes through them and no I'm definitely not a drone, lol. I'm a regular student.
I stumbled across this site because a friend of mine recommended I teach an Ed2Go course, and I wanted to see whether it is legit or some diploma mill.
I've taught at universities and community colleges for more than 10 years. I was also a Dean at a for-profit college that had internet coursework. I've also administered correspondence courses through university cooperative extension. So I have extensive experience in brick and mortar as well as alternative delivery methods.
I understand your impulsive response to protect the brand name of your university, but it sounds both snobbish and self-serving. While you CLAIM the main issue is accountability, I think we all sense the undertone that you don't consider this worthy of academic merit. Your title says "Ed2Go is NOT higher education." That says it all.
Apparently, universities and colleges see some value in extending educational opportunities beyond their ivy covered walls to non-traditional students. Many of these courses are non-credit, non-degree classes and don't claim to be otherwise.
I have seen courses for academic credit at top ranked public universities on wine tasting, the sociology of Star Trek, astrology, yoga, and tarot card reading. I have seen so-called "independent study" courses which gave academic credit for attending anti-war rallies. At UC Berkeley, students can design and teach their own courses, and participants get academic credit.
I took one course as an undergrad that was nothing less than advocacy for communes and communism. I've had teachers protected by tenure that were so badly organized and taught it was more of a distraction than a learning experience. I submit that official, for credit, university courses have little to no oversight nor is there much consideration toward academic merit. I've submitted courses for approval throug university committees, and as long as you make the proposal sound good, the committee will approve it. But once you're past that gate, there is no further review - you can alter the course substantially from the initial write up and there is no recourse, especially if you are tenured.
I'm offering no opinion on Ed2Go because I still don't know anything about it. But if your university approves of the listing, they are probably getting money for it. Instead of questioning the profit motive of Ed2Go which must meet with the approval of its customers, you should consider the profit motives of your own university. You should also consider that your own salary is inflated by taxpayer subsidies for higher education that have few to no external benefits.
You should also consider the artificial demand for your skills created by university and college core requirements. Ed2Go students take courses by choice. Many of your students take your courses because they are compulsory for their degrees.
I, too, was annoyed to see the listings as if they were offered and backed by the local colleges when they weren't. I totally understand your point that it could hurt your school's reputation, but remember that it can also be a way to persuade a student to take classes at your school once they've tried it out at Ed2Go.
But, they get shady when it comes to how much you earn for those 100 seats in your course, saying you get paid "royalties" and "our best advice is "don't quit your day job."
But basic math makes this seem shady. A one month course seating 100 people and charging them $100 a person to take it would bring in $10,000 to Ed2Go. If they can't pay people teaching that course enough in a month for them to quit their day job (most teachers make $2,000-$3,000 a month), then they must be pocketing just about all of it.
It's got to be a little like printing money, and absolutely no way to keep well-educated and talented teachers.